>
Arsenal News

Archives

Arsenal News
Arsenal News
August 2019
M T W T F S S
« Jul    
 1234
567891011
12131415161718
19202122232425
262728293031  

How Arsenal used Millwall’s tactics to rise from the ashes

February 6, 1909:  Millwall Athletic 1 Arsenal 1, FA Cup 2nd round

Crowd: 32,000

By Tony Attwood

On February 6th, 1909 Arsenal played Millwall Athletic in the FA Cup in front of a crowd which is recorded as an astonishing 32,000.

Arsenal had only played in front of bigger crowds when playing a couple of league matches at Chelsea (where 50,000 was not unknown) and in the second of their to cup semi-finals where 36,000 turned up at St Andrews to see the game against Sheffield Wednesday.

This particular Millwall match in 1909 is to be remembered for two reasons.  First, the size of the crowd, which was explained by the fact that Millwall were Arsenal’s local local rivals.  The other was that Millwall at the time were planning to move south, across the River Thames and and find success. At the time of this game, the foundations for the new Millwall ground (The Den) were already being laid.

Although Henry Norris was not at Arsenal at the time of this match he would have noted the match, not least because one of his teams, Croydon Common, had been knocked out of the cup in the previous round by Woolwich Arsenal FC.

Norris would have looked at this crowd at Millwall, the rivalry, and the move across the river, and noted it all.   Then as he plotted the move of Arsenal in 1913 – the move that would take Arsenal in the opposite direction, he would have recalled exactly what Millwall had done.

Millwall Rovers initially played on the Isle of Dogs, being formed one year before Arsenal in 1885.   In April 1889 the club changed its name to Millwall Athletic and they were founder members of the Southern League.

In the first 25 years of their existence they occupied no less than four different grounds but had never found huge support – and the 1909 game against Arsenal from across the river may well have been their biggest crowd during this era.

So in 1910 Millwall (having dropped the name Athletic – which was taken when they moved to a ground of the same name) moved to a new stadium, The Den, in New Cross.   A fictionalised account of their opening game at the ground is provided in Making the Arsenal.

Woolwich Arsenal never played Millwall as during the remaining years when both were south London clubs, but the 1909 match was still a major local derby, just as the Cup game between the two sides had been in 1893 when 20,000 turned up at the Manor Ground for a third qualifying round match.  Given that Arsenal’s largest crowd in the League in that inaugural season was 13,000 the power of local rivalry was clear.

So Henry Norris, thinking about what to do with the club in 1912, had in Millwall a model.  First, a move across the river need be no bad thing.  Millwall had made a success out of their move south.  Second a move that left one very close to another club, could be a benefit rather than a distraction.

Of course Norris had other reasons for picking Highbury as his ultimate venue for the new Arsenal in 1913.  Most importantly, it was the issue of travel.  The games between Arsenal and Millwall had been difficult for supporters because of the local transport difficulties.  Norris wanted a venue that was served by good public transport.

Highbury, with its underground stations and its railway connections was ideal, in exactly the way that The Manor Ground in Plumstead was not ideal.  You could get to Highbury readily no matter whether you were coming from the north, south or west.  Only journeys in from the east were more difficult.  At Plumstead all journeys were difficult.

So it must have been with great interest that Henry Norris watched what happened when Millwall played Arsenal in 1909 and then what happened when Millwall moved south in 1910.  And it certainly must have been clear to Norris that what Millwall could do in one direction, Arsenal could do in another.

The complete story of Woolwich Arsenal, including the move from Plumstead to Highbury is reported in Woolwich Arsenal: the club that changed football.

4 comments to How Arsenal used Millwall’s tactics to rise from the ashes

  • mark andrews

    Tony,

    A clever take on the two club’s river jumps, but as far as the transport question goes the point surely is that it was not difficult for Millwall fans to get to Arsenal and visa versa – but that it was difficult for others who were not so local.

    There was an abundance of local transport as shown in the “Crowd at Woolwich Arsenal FC” book: http://www.blog.woolwicharsenal.co.uk/archives/4802 : There was also very little crowd trouble in these derby games, just alot of banter.

    And as researching the crowd chapter for the new Royal Arsenal book it becomes apparent how the Arsenal supporters got about to other parts of London, predominantly over the river on the ferries and onto their destination via the train from North Woolwich. Conversely the largest RAFC crowd in the 1892/93 season was 14,000 against Millwall who had at least 2,000 followers at the Invicta. The only trouble being an Arsenal supporter being removed by Police and committeemen for swearing at the referee.

    Mark

  • Tony,

    Also Norris never owned Croydon Common.

  • Tony Attwood

    Mark, when I was researching “Making the Arsenal” I am sure I found evidence that he had involvement in Croydon Common. Are you saying just that he didn’t own it, or that he had no involvement? It will take me a while to go back over that research, but I know I wouldn’t have used it in “Making” if I had not found a clear reference somewhere.

  • Tony,

    Be great if you could find it, but its not in the definitive Woolwich Arsenal book.

Leave a Reply

You can use these HTML tags

<a href="" title=""> <abbr title=""> <acronym title=""> <b> <blockquote cite=""> <cite> <code> <del datetime=""> <em> <i> <q cite=""> <s> <strike> <strong>